Could you tell me about your first experiences with technology in the home?

Well, I have been thinking about this and one of the things is that we didn't have electric light. We had gas lighting. You had to come in, across the room in the dark and light the gas mantel. Have you ever seen a gas mantel?

Yes

And sometimes they wore out and then you would put a light in and you would have to go and get another one. What else?

What about ovens?

We had a gas oven. My grandmother had a stove, rather like an Aga but old fashioned and it was hot all the time and one dreadful experience was when somebody left the door opened and the cat who liked warm things went in it and somebody walked by and shut the door..... and that was the end of the cat. What other things? Well we didn't have telephones and not many people had cars. Cars were quite unusual.

When did your family first get a car?

My family never had a car. My mother and father no, never. When I first went out with my husband, he had a Riley Monarco. Which I thought was terribly smart. I think that was part of the attraction, and er... I was how old? About 18 when I first met him. Not many people had cars, what else?

There are improvements nowadays where you have got hi-fi's and Television and Dishwashers and Fridges, did you have anything like that?

Oh, no, no not any of that in my home. We used to have larders with a stone shelf which was usually on the cool side of the house or flat. But no, no fridges or dishwashers or anything like that. And certainly no washing machine. My Mother used to wash on a wash board, you know, like that. And drying you hung the things out on the line. Which I often wish you could do here.

And what were your irons like? Was it one of those ones you put in the fire to heat up?

That's exactly what it was, a black thing and you had two. When one got cool you rested it, put it back and used the other one. That's what we had.

Did your family ever have a radio? Was that your first luxury?

Yes we did have a radio. I can remember it. Perhaps when I was about five or six. Can't remember beyond that. Yes, we did have a radio.

Looking at your experiences of technology, there have been lots of improvements, but do you see anything which has made life worse?

I sometimes think television is a great force for education but some of things on it are really dreadful and I think we amused ourselves in the evenings by playing board games and things like that. We didn't sit and watch television. I mean children nowadays take it for granted. They rush home form school, turn on the box immediately, whereas I used to rush home form school to listen to Henry Hall on the radio. Have you ever heard of Henry Hall? Now Henry Hall had a dance band and I used to rush home from school to listen to him.

So, do you have children?

I've got two children.

Do they live nearby or far away?

One lives in Winterslow, which is north of Salisbury, and the other one lives in Norfolk.

So the telephone has been a good help in communicating?

Oooh indeed! We didn't have telephones. Ooooh no, no telephones. Good grief no.

So were you born in a village or a town?

I was born in London in a flat.

So that must be the place that got the first real technology?

Yes, though we were poor. We weren't very rich in those days. I don't think my father ever (and this will make you laugh ) earned more than three pounds a week. I mean I know values have changed but even then we were poor. I'm not lying, we were. Have no doubt about it. Very poor.

So when telephones first came, were they in the post offices and were they for public use or were they in the homes?

I don't remember telephones at all. I don't remember. We used to have telegrams usually bringing bad news, you know, but I don't remember telephones in my childhood at all.

When did you first get one? Was it when you lived on your own?

Yes I suppose. I don't even remember having one when I first got married.

Do you have computers and E-mail?

Oh no! Nothing like that.

So you just stuck to the telephone?

No computers weren't heard of in those days. And calculators, of course, taking calculators into class in school, well that would be unheard of, I mean. You didn't have calculators. I go into a shop and you know they have these things which tell them how much change to give and I've got the change ready, and the girls say to me how did you do that? And I say, well, you know, in here [pointing to head] I've got a little computer.

So your first memories of car travel are when you were eighteen?

Well yes I did have an uncle who had a car - I can't remember what make it was. He used to take us out in it occasionally and that was a great treat. It really was. But my first boyfriend, who later became my husband, had a car and he used to take me out in it.

So going on holiday - did you travel by trains? Aeroplanes?

Not Aeroplanes. Certainly not aeroplanes. Trains, yes.

And have they improved or got worse?

Oh yes, they've improved. I think we went by train. Yes we must have done. We didn't have many holidays, we were too hard up.

So travel was expensive then?

Well it was expensive for us because we were very poor. And this was in the thirties, of course, as I was growing up. I was born in 1920. I was, what, nineteen when the war broke out. So that it was... The thirties were a hard time. The time of the depression and a lot of people were hard up then

So did things get worse through the war?

No, they got better because more people got jobs, I think. There was a lot of unemployment in the thirties, and more people had jobs because there were munitions factories. People went into the services and they had better pay, and I think things were better. I was lucky because I was quite a bright child, even though I say it myself. And I won a good scholarship to a grammar school. Most children left school at fourteen, that was the age at which they left school. There was no opening for the market of that. They could go to night school. But I got a scholarship to a grammar school, and I stayed on until I was eighteen, and I wanted to become a teacher. But there was no, no money. In those days there was nothing much in the way of grants, and I remember my mother coming to see the head when I was about to leave school, and talking about my wish to become a teacher and it was going to cost £100. I don't know if it was £100 a year, or £100 over all but I know the figure of £100 was mentioned. We couldn't afford it and I remember the Head saying haven't you any rich relatives who could help you out and my Mother said No. So I took the exam into the Civil Service. But I achieved my ambition in the end: I became a teacher.

How long did you work in the Civil Service?

Well, another thing that you may not know. In those days in common with many other professions, I can't remember which ones, but certainly in the Civil Service, if a woman married she was out and she didn't have to have a baby. If she marries she lost her established status. Her pension rights, she was out. I married during the war, I was about 23 I think when I married. They let me stay on during the war as a temporary Civil Servant. But I had no pension rights or anything like that so I stayed on during the war.

What kind of machinery did you come into contact with in the Civil Service?

There were typists. There was this thing called the typing pool which was a great room full of typists. The very Senior people had their own Secretary Typists. If you wanted anything typed you sent it to the typing pool. There were no photocopiers or anything like that.

So if you wanted ten letters they had to be written out ten times.

Yes, or there was a strange thing and I used to use it after I became a teacher and it was a strange sort of jelly and it produced a sort of mauve copy, but you couldn't do many of them.

Was it some sort of printing press?

Not like that, no. It just produced a copy, I can't remember how it was done now. [Probably referring to a spirit duplicator.]

Was that helpful when being a teacher?

Well yes, I can remember making copies of exam papers I had made up and doing it on this jelly thing. I didn't become a teacher until I was forty-ish. After I had had my children. I thought, Right I have always wanted to be a teacher and I got my Higher School - we didn't have A-Levels in those days we had School Certificate and Higher School Certificate. And I thought I got my Higher School so I can be a teacher and so I applied when I was about forty when I had had my children and they were on their way as it were and I went to Salisbury College which is where the Museum is now, for two years.

During your time at college, what kind of equipment did you come into contact with?

Not a lot as far as I remember.

Just still your standard typewriters?

Yes, yes. Certainly not computers or anything like that.

So when did you give up working as a teacher?

Well I only did a year in this country and then we went to Hong Kong. And I taught Chinese children in Hong Kong for two years but there was nothing. We used to have a little man who was in charge of all exam papers. He used to duplicate them in some way but I don't know what machinery he used, I'm afraid.

Going back to the home and domestic improvements. What did you have before the Hoover?

A sweeping brush.

For carpets, or did you just mainly have rugs?

No, it was a carpet sweeper. You have seen those haven't you? You just push and pull and the dust goes up and you just empty it out. Later on we had a carpet sweeper.

What has been the best improvement. The most helpful?

I would say the washing machine, really. Because I can remember washing at my grandmothers house and she had a big family and all these sheets to be washed. It was a vast undertaking. Everything was boiled in a boiler. A big Copper they called it. Do you remember any of these things?

No, no.

Everything was boiled in a Copper and then it had to be "blued". You put in through a blue rinse to keep it white. All sheets were white in those days, no coloured ones. And then it all had to be dried.

A very time consuming process then?

Oh yes a whole day really for a big family.

So what was the next step up from the Copper?

I can remember having one where you put the washing in, and you put the lid on and the lid had a handle and you turned the handle which agitated the washing inside.

This was manual process?

Yes, oh yes.

And how long would you spend rotating the handle?

As much time as you had got. You got fed up with it soon.

Were you working when you had all your domestic chores to do?

No, no I wasn't you see. Well I was for a bit, because I continued working through the war, but as soon as I started to have children I didn't work anymore.

Did you find that the improvements with the washing machines even though they were still manual gave you more time to spend with your family?

Yes, I suppose.

What is your first memory of a non-manual washing machine then?

I can't remember what date it was. I had one when there weren't many electrical points in the kitchen and I had to move it across and of course a lot of people had these Twin tubs, I didn't. Have you heard of those?

I have heard of them, I don't know what they do.

Well you washed in one and you had a pair of tongs and lifted the washing out of one and into the other one and it would dry it in some way. I can't remember how. Not like the ones nowadays. I don't quite know how it worked because I didn't have one but I know that people did have them.

So was that manual?

Oh yes, yes I think so.

So when did you get your first automatic one? Approximately?

I suppose thirty years ago.

When you weren't working and you weren't doing the domestic chores did you have lots of time to do leisure activities? Were you part of any clubs or anything?

I did a lot of dress making.

The sewing machine, was that a big help?

Oh yes, my Mother had a sewing machine it was a Singer and it was in a wooden case and you lifted up the top and brought up the sewing machine and it was all metal underneath. Wrought iron, the wiggley stuff you know. It was my job to dust it. But the washing machine has been a great advancement. I wouldn't say the dishwasher has because , I mean I've got one here but I don't use it very much unless I have visitors.

So a Dishwasher is more of a luxury whereas a Washing Machine was more of a necessity?

I would say so, yes. I don't know what I would do without it and a refrigerator, of course.

This place must be centrally heated. What did you have back in your first home was it just a fire?

A coal fire it was until the Government made London smokeless zones and you weren't allowed to burn coal. I came into Salisbury after my husband died. I was living out at Hale and we had a big garden with lots of trees and my husband used to chop down a lot of these trees when it got a bit crowded and we used to have wood fires there.

During the winter it still must have been cold in the bedroom?

Oh yes, freezing. But you didn't think anything of it really. I don't know. You accepted the fact that it was cold.

Do you still think the washing machine is the best improvement?

Well, for me it is. I mean Central Heating I suppose one takes for granted now. It wouldn't worry me if I didn't have central heating but it would worry me if I didn't have a Washing Machine. Of course we used the Laundry a lot more in those days you know. The man coming around and collecting the sheets if you didn't want to do them yourself.

Do you drive a car?

I did until I had a couple of accidents, and so I gave up. I didn't greatly enjoy it and I didn't learn until I was about forty and I was in Cyprus.

You obviously travelled a bit.

My husband was in the Civil Service as I was until I became a teacher and he was posted all over the world. Not America, Germany, Hong Kong, Cyprus.

So how did you travel from one country to another?

When I first went to Egypt you didn't fly, you went by ship.

That must have taken a long time.

It did, but it was very pleasant. It was like a holiday. Quite restful.

You didn't have any entertainment or anything?

No,no. It was quite pleasant. You didn't go by air.

Do you still travel?

Not a lot.

Your first experiences of an aeroplane? Was it uncomfortable?

Well I haven't flown for sometime so I really have no comparison.

They have on-board cinemas now on planes

Oh no no, nothing when I was first.... no.

Entertainment in general. Has the improved greatly or do you prefer going to the theatre where it is all live?

I still am great enthusiast for the Theatre. I never acted myself, but I like watching and I can appreciated it. It was more of a treat to go to the cinema in London in my day.

Do you feel there is less class distinction now in the Theatre than there was ?

Well yes, we were poor as I told you. I can remember the Debutantes going to be presented at Buckingham Palace, and I used to think this was wonderful.

Did you go to the cinema a lot?

Yes and the cinema was more of a treat too. You didn't have these cinemas where you have two or three or four cinemas. It was just one cinema. It was much more of a treat than it is now.

And Colour TV, do think that is better?

Oh yes it is better, but you now we take for granted this thing. We didn't have one in the home. Well I did know someone who was very rich and who's Father did have a TV. I think it was a black and white.

Is that why you think people treated the cinema as more of a treat?

I am sure I did, yes.

Going back to leisure time and luxuries, do you think women's Hairdressers have got better?

I don't know really as I don't have much experience of them. When I was younger my Mother cut my hair.

Did your husband like having an electric razor?

He used to have a brush and soap and then he began to get a skin rash and the doctor suggested he use an electric. With a certain amount of reluctance he used it and it cured the rash.

As a customer then, do you think Supermarkets have improved, or did you prefer the individual stores in every town?

I can remember going to Sainsbury's and you went to one counter for your bacon and one for your butter and they would way it up for you. It was much slower but in many ways it was better. I used to hand my order in and they would deliver it. No charge. But now the only place I know that will deliver now is Iceland and even then you have to spend £25, which isn't hard I know.

Which do you prefer, the individual old fashioned stores where they delivered, or the more modern supermarkets.

Well, there is more selection in the supermarkets you can get all sorts of things that you have never heard of. I believe you can get a bus in certain parts of Salisbury to Waitrose, a free bus, but I can't because I live too close. None of the other supermarkets deliver. It is better in some ways and worse in others.

During your teaching years did you see great improvements of developing technological developments for children?

They didn't use computers in my time. But don't forget it is a long time since I stopped teaching. Twenty years perhaps.

Did they just have pens and paper?

In many ways, certainly primary education, it was better. I think the children had a better basic grounding in mental arithmetic. They weren't dependent on their calculators because the didn't have them.

You see a calculator as a bad thing that is making people lazy?

Yes.

What about TV and Entertainment?

Yes, I do, yes.

Do you prefer the machines they have in banks now for getting your money out of?

Well you don't have to queue up, not often anyway. I suppose some people forget their numbers. But it is quite simple, yes I think that is an advance anyway.

You don't mind the impersonal effect of dealing with a machine rather than a person?

No. You are only getting money out.

What about these credit cards?

Switch I use, I think that is very convenient because it comes straight out of your bank account. But I won't have any of the others, VISA etc. It encourages people to build up a debt and spend what they don't have. But switch is very good.

Do you like these Mobile phones?

I think they are very useful for business people but I don't like them going off in restaurants.

Going back to the Leisure industry, were you ever part of a Gym?

No. I used to belong to a Tennis Club and play a lot of the Tennis. Wooden Tennis racquets with strings.

Is there anything you have ever seen and thought that made life worse, like the TV, or the Cars polluting the World?

Yes. Cars are a great problem. They are a terrific boon, but on the other hand , I stand outside Sainsburys and I see all these cars and I think of all these cars polluting the atmosphere. You have to provide car parks, vast areas of land taken up for car parks.

Is there anything that hasn't improved in technology, that you think could go further?

I hate cleaning windows, but then I just don't do it.

You could get someone to come and do it for you. There are lots of amenities like that. But that was always there. Do you get the feeling that there are more services that you can employ, like window cleaners? More available?

Yes I suppose. I have doorstep deliveries (milk etc). I can remember when the milkman would come to the door and my Mother would bring a jug of milk and he'd dip a little a container and pour it into the jug and then she would pay him. So I think that has improved. Freezers of course are very useful aren't they?

Do you use yours a lot then?

Well I only have a little one here. When I was out at Hale I had a huge chest freezer, and I do miss that.

So, before the freezer what did you do, buy everything fresh every day?

Well, yes.

So having a freezer and a fridge and a washing machine, do you find that they have all saved you time?

Which you then waste by watching that thing. [indicates television]

Is that how you feel it is gone, that we spend more time in front of the TV?

Oh, I am sure that is how it is gone.

In a way it has made society more lazy ...

More lazy, more relaxed you could say. Either way.

If you could choose it which way would you have it?

Oh as we are now. Because you needn't watch that.

So you feel it is a choice, but it's a choice that a lot of people choose.

It's easier to switch that thing on, it doesn't matter what's on, it's sort of wallpaper for the eyes, they're not selective. I am selective, I go through the Radio Times and ring what I would like to see. It's a force for good, but it's also a force for laziness.

Do you find that you have more leisure time now, compared to when you were working?

Well yes, obviously, but I have always spent my leisure time reading. These things are a great advance, aren't they?

Tape recorders?

Yes, tape recorders. Well we wouldn't do this sort of work when we were in a grammar school, and we certainly didn't have those. I expect you use them a lot.

Do you think that handwriting, along with other things that aren't being taught in school, are suffering, especially as the computers are coming through?

Probably, I certainly think that mental arithmetic along with tables is suffering, that children can't compute in their heads like I can and we used to.

Maybe education is focusing on something else.

It is probably wider, yes I think so. I don't know much about the children who aren't very able. I think things have probably improved for them.

There are a lot more amenities that are available to them. Taxi services that can accommodate wheelchairs.

And Special Schools.

Contribute your memories

Return to Archers Court